Author Topic: grappling with the myths 2  (Read 24999 times)

âspen

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #15 on: 12 February 2013 12:33:44 PM »
Hi i will gladly explain.  Last week there was a glitch in the forum software;  more details are in τεχνική.  While the glitch was there it was impossible either to post or to admin.  Also, strangely, it was possible to log on but not to log off.

At first I thought it was probably a problem with the webhost (dreamhost) because the symptoms seemed to fit perfectly with ability to read but inability to update the database.  (Being able to log on without updating the database is imaginable;  being unable to log off without updating the "last active" field in the user's profile is also imaginable.)

But on cursory investigation it seemed the database connection was working fine.  The problem was more likely somewhere else.

The situation needed a cry for help.

Also, it needed a holding message on the front page of the forum so that forum members and visitors could have some idea of what was happening.

So the question was, what minimal and easily undoable change to preferably a single field in the database would meet both these needs at the same time with maximum immediacy?



Later, after the problem was fixed (see other thread), the question was whether to change things back to what they were before, or to try something new.

Well by that time the conversation had moved on to things like what is the forum about and what do we care about.

Here are some thoughts ... what would be wonderful is a forum where skeptics and believers can passionately engage.  Sustained Reaction came close sometimes, but it was not sweet enough.  The Hat is giving it a good try, but it is not ruthless enough.  Can we envisage a place that is sweeter than SR and more ruthless than the Hat.

Mr X

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #16 on: 12 February 2013 04:06:59 PM »
thanks for that merlin. that clears things up.

i dont think i saw the php edit, only the existential crisis one.

your thoughts are also welcome. before reading that, my list of what merlin wants from the forum would be -

1. i dont know.

i would, with you in particular especially, like to know an little bit more background. such as, i have no idea if you ever studied castaneda or not or why you were at SR.

for bond, correct me if im wrong or thinking of someone else, i think he has some connection to things like tai chi perhaps, possibly works in new age fields or something associated with, has an nice interest in science, and how it applys to mysteries. he has an abstract yet analytical mind, sometimes too abstract for others (such as senor). a world traveller, interested in an vast range of things. crappy internet at home. for you, my list of merlin things is

1. does computer stuff, i dont know. soft ears. family man.

not that i am keeping lists.

the idea of belifers and skeptics is great thought. im on board for that. i think i actually know what you are saying.

when active on SR i kept tabs on all toltec releated sites, about once per week, including the hat. i havent' done so in some time, so am not aware of the hat activities. but knowing that forum their "try" would be limited by small audience and general slowness.

understandably, SR could not possibly be kind enough. too strict, for no their own reasons.

as i came late to the SR party, i understand you guys are more familiar with each other than i am familiar with you, hence questions. and i understand i missed the point where/when it came close. i does seem there were many great intelligent posters over the years that were driven away.

i can certainly envisage the forum you describe. there would have to be parameters, such as "no super Hawaiians". limits on acceptable behavior, such as obvious no threats, no excessive insults or abuse. aside from the very basics, if the admins have no hard agenda, if everyone is free to speak and explore differing points of view in an civil manner, i dont see a problem, it could and should work.

ruthless side i guess, would be not taking a person seriously when they preach about being an level 5 laser lotus. perhaps.

i do think the vast majority of casta belifers wouldnt post on an forum about their life. especially post and be 100% honest. i also think most skeptics wouldnt' want to debate with belifers as there is no point. but for the portion of each side that do want to have discuss, giving an stable platform for them to do so is an good idea.

so and bit of soft,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if-UzXIQ5vw

and some not soft,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnlXaWf0luM

it seems.

x

âspen

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #17 on: 12 February 2013 06:08:34 PM »
Hello I am honoured you think I am merlin but I am ju4o.

The idea is that ideally admins should not have to play much if any part in the conversation but for a small start up forum that is not easy.

Faute de mieux it can be a good idea for admins to have separate posting identities for when they are being admins from when they are being their passionate selves.

But then it is important the alias should be clear.  I did explain this when I first introduced myself but that was a while ago.  I should think of another way of making it clear.

Also if you look back through the conversations there is a place where I made a third posting identity which I explained as follows,



Anyway to recap just these 3 are me.

P.S. after writing all that and checking back in to the forum to post it I couldn't help laughing when I saw again yr first line, "thanks for that merlin. that clears things up."  Well I hope now things are clearer!

* edit * P.P.S. flattered as well as honoured
« Last Edit: 12 February 2013 09:45:19 PM by âspen »

Mr X

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #18 on: 15 February 2013 03:10:12 PM »
thanks for that aspen, that clears things up.

yes it is pretty funny. i can remeber asscociating ju40 with touring machine way back early on, but it didnt click. ive said it before and will say again, im not an fan of multiple user names, due to the weirdness it has caused in casta net and the whole sock puppet thing they are so fond of.

my questions towards merls still stand, but now i guess they count for you to ju40.

i dont see how an start up forum could be without admins posting early. 100 members, sure, we could blend into the crowd. last time i looked, sr seemed to be just admins with maybe the occasianal ginko. but sr has been for an long time admin guided based. and its not great, stifling infact.

i dont mean to offend anyone for the outer sattelite casta net forums, but consolidating user bases and data of mostly redundant forums is an idea worth looking into, to build up an user base. some autonomy allowed in terms of subforums, i dont know, just and suggestion.

my interest is also peaked now, why would you be flattened and honored to be merlin ? is he some saint that we should be so lucky to be mistaken for ? i would like to know. and the original post is now double questions, such as ju40, what brought you to sr in the first place ?

i too did laugh out loud.

x

Merlin

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #19 on: 15 February 2013 06:57:56 PM »
Quote from: Dave
....why would you be flattened and honored to be merlin ? is he some saint that we should be so lucky to be mistaken for ?

The guy (Merlin) created stonehenge!
Doesn't qualify for sainthood, but is impressive enough.

You really should be aware that Ra6 "doesn't do" questions.
What questions do you want answering?




I like the caring about link

Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can?

Mr X

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #20 on: 16 February 2013 06:32:44 PM »
hello there real merlion,

did he really create stone hedge ? i would need some citations to consider that.

i actually started to like that merlin show, then it ended. what is the best version of the merlin story ? excalibur movie, mists of avalon, that 21 lessons of merlin book from an sketchy source, or something else ?

let me think, what questions. possibly, since bond doesnt do questions, i will ask you 2.

1. why doesnt bond do questions.

2. what brought you and bond to sr, which led you to being here now. what is your point of interest, are you new agers, ex-casta net junkies, what.

just asking as it would be stupod of me not to ask. curiousity is all. if  you asked me questions i would probably either not answer or skirt around them. but i have to ask. as i would like to know, to satiate my brian.

if you dont answer, then for the rest of my life on earth, i will always wonder about the answers. when i am 80 i will think "why did bond not do questions". but if you dont anwser i will also understand we are an disparate group trying to achieve something rather big without letting personal concerns or even the chance of establishing friendship and understanding of each other get in the way. there is nothing wrong with that, i would just like to know which way we are going.

that too i can understand, if we are all business here then just let me know, is fine with me. i will focus on the forum only, i am also curious as to how that will pan out.

i was serious about consolidation by the way. consider me not part of the diplomacy crew if that were to happen, i am sure you guys have more contacts and could put it on the table in an better way.

my other link seemed to have died, so here it is again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fYreJcrtDU

x

ju4o

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #21 on: 17 February 2013 01:38:24 PM »
Quote
"doesn't do" questions

The august and excellent merlin is exaggerating.  As he occasionally does.  Your questions may be good and well worth addressing.  Note also,

Quote
as the forum is small at the moment, nice and cool and chill, i would very much like to know some more about the other forum memebers. it is only natural to be curious. for instance if we suddenly got 50 memebers overnight i would probably use my admin powers to go back and edit out anything from my own posts that i would deem too personal, such as day z talk.

An unarchived email list solves all the problems which are currently swirling about this thread.  Forum + email list is a good mix of technology.  Please see new thread in τεχνική.

~j

Mr X

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Re:
« Reply #22 on: 18 February 2013 03:12:34 PM »
okay so now merlin is both honourable  and august. that doesnt clear thing up.

the email seems like an good idea. i will need some further explantion of how it works. i think i have signed up to it, but we will discuss in the other thread.

i would i like to ask, as an general questions, peoples positions on data value / piracy. for instance, the question is, is there any problem taking all that data sustained action  gathered, and hosting it. what are the moral implications of consolidation/building and grass roots forum / building user and database - if this forum is an real endevour, it means long term, such as possible and decade and beyond. data gathering and preservation seems logical.

my answer to that question is yes.
i will give my reasoning on the email list when we are sure it is working.

it reminds me of back to basics indeed. wasnt there email lists that preceded sr. ixtlan or something. good use of technology indeed. probably far more chance of getting old timer to participate too. there would need to be some sort of whitelisting or vetting to keep the list free from malicious people. all in all i really like it.

x
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmTe47giKBs

ju4o

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #23 on: 18 February 2013 06:30:32 PM »
Quote
for instance, the question is, is there any problem taking all that data sustained action gathered, and hosting it.

Well I think it would mainly be a matter of asking permission of the copyright holders.  But as far as I'm aware it is already hosted quite satisfactorily.  Would be good if you could explain more about why this is the question.

Quote
i will give my reasoning on the email list when we are sure it is working.

Looking forward to it.  I expect u will spring some surprises on us.  For example am I right in thinking that when you write,  almost every word comes out for unknown reasons with a capital letter at the front, even when you are trying to be on best behaviour, like writing a CV or something, and then in order to make it more readable you run it through a word processor, but owing to paucity of technical resources it is a rather primitive word processor which simply gets rid of all the capitals altogether.

Except in youtube links where your word processor has been persuaded to leave the capital letters intact.  Also sometimes when you mention SR by its initials.  How you managed to get that modification in to your word processor is at least as interesting as the moral aspects of data piracy.  This is fascinating stuff.  ESPECIALLY how a mind such as yours manages to combine all that with an interest in "data gathering and preservation" and "building user and database".  I would think that accurate spelling and punctuation is very important in such matters.  Maybe your interest in hosting data is a desperate yell from your subconscious, the ONLY WAY LEFT to straighten out your mind.  This could be really important.

Mr X

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #24 on: 19 February 2013 06:33:45 PM »
hosted satisfactorily, yes, as in it stays online, but did they ever update the format after many requests. do you remeber that. to stop it looking like an late 90s website. make it easy to navigate and browse, make it relevant for the modern day internet user.

anyway, aware i can ask any question in the world and not expect and answer, i was just thinking out loud about the forum. having an mission statement or very crystal clear objective for the forum would be helpful, but i just aware you would like and forum for belifers and skeptics to debate passionatley. i am not aware of what merlin wants.

if people were debating about an subject that includes years worth of pre discussed information/data/critical information, it makes sense to preserve that information so it can be referenced and not lost to time. if the current preservation method is outdated or hosted by questionable people, it makes sense to copy and preserve outside the other influence, with long term goals of storing the data.

if the current hosters dont want to give permission, there is the option of just taking the data. it is possible is all. now, if the data, in this instance SA, is non profit, as in an persons lively hood doesnt depend on it, then free internet reigns. if it is commercial intellectual property that earns someone and living, then common morals reigns.

just some out loud thoughts.

i think i you wanted to think me through, mr bond, you should under think, not over think. far to many variables.

for instance, youtube links are copy and pasted from the browser address bar.

its very easy to make and word processor make it all capitals or all no capitals.

sometimes when and red line appears under my words, i right click and correct spell the word. sometimes i dont.

all the times, i quickly read through what i am about to post using the preview button. most all times i will make edits and it is then that i add capitals such as SR, if those words are near the edit.

and more variables.

techincal resources are only and 3.8ghz i5 with 8gb rams. enough for open office. i was looking in an sql database the other day, i could find what i was looking for, but yes editing the letters numbers and cases would take finess.

it is funny, bond, who said i have an interest in data gather and preserves ?. or even building user bases and data. that is what i think makes sense for the forum. if we are going to work on and forum, those things make sense, to me. they could also be discarded as ideas, going through one idea after another also makes sense, brainstorming until and workable, good strategy is found. but i would be doing that for you and merls, and anyone who uses the forum in the future. if the remnants of casta net could coalesce into and user base, and could handle talking with people who question them in and neutral environment, that would be great, but it makes no difference to me personal if it does or doesn't.

if i straightened out my brain, i am almost 100% that would be the end of me and the internet, i would never say another word. so for right now, twisted brian is good.

x

ps.
can somebody send and email on the list to check its working.

Merlin

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #25 on: 19 February 2013 10:53:41 PM »
Quote from:  Peter
1. why doesnt bond do questions.
I'm not sure why.  I put it down to one of his many, many oddities.  By the way, did he not answer your questions yet?  :pop:

Quote from:  Peter again
2. what brought you and bond to sr, which led you to being here now. what is your point of interest, are you new agers, ex-casta net junkies, what.
I was looking for a poem of which I could recall a fragment, then I got sidetracked by the search results.
I'm neither new ager, junkie or etc.  Just a normo.

Quote from:  Ra6
But as far as I'm aware it is already hosted quite satisfactorily.
Not exactly.  Every February and June renewal time it is liable to go down (as it currently has).

Quote from:  Peter yet again
hosted satisfactorily, yes, as in it stays online, but did they ever update the format after many requests. do you remember that. to stop it looking like an late 90s website. make it easy to navigate and browse, make it relevant for the modern day internet user.
When I enquired about updating the site, the current liar owner assured me he had a team of experts working on it.  I do have a copy of the entire site.  I also have permission (e-mail) from the founder to put the site up again when it falls over, so I wouldn't feel bad about doing that.  Although I would think it wise to avoid putting up contributions from some third parties without their explicit approval.


What's a e-mail list for?

Almost forgot...tupe...  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98l27t4elDo
« Last Edit: 19 February 2013 11:32:14 PM by Merlin »
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can?

Mr X

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #26 on: 20 February 2013 06:54:00 PM »
hello there normie,

ok yes mr bond has some oddities but i think that is acceptable. and normo, we could do with one of them.

i dont belief you were seeking poetry, you are and well known sr name, there has to be more reason for your presence.

but no new ager, no nag net junker, is good to know. but he mystery still remains.

okay well that is interested, the hosting is not even satisfactory. great picture, confirmed.

i find it silly, we are on and sweet ruthless forum, yet you even dare hesitate to sweep up the booty.

if they are lax, why wouldnt you buy up the domain. keep it, negotiate with it as leverage, move it to an country where pursuing it leagally would be pointless, re purpose it, sure, but simply saying its there for the taking and not ruthlessly take it, madness.

you seem to have said that the owner liar  is unsatifactory. that is belifable.  your morals are on par, you have an copy and permissions. why you are saying but not doing, i dont understand. but thank you very much for youre input. very interesting. just keep in mind what forum you are posting in.

unarchived email list seems good, lets see.

unexpectadly good tupe.

x.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NduGJ0F5sdI

Merlin

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #27 on: 20 February 2013 07:50:43 PM »
Point #1 | Don't misunderstand, oddities, peculiar and unpredictable behaviour, spectacular faux pas etc... = good.

Point #2 | Whether you believe or not... it's true.

Point #3 | I think I'm not the only one who has all of the SA website, so some other who has not the same talent for procrastination could also do the do.

The domain name is an important aspect of the site.  I heard that some publications even make specific reference to it, but there has to be a period of some time passing with the default in place before it can become available for auction etc. is my understanding.

Still don't know what email list is... like sending email to each other with cc?

Tupe: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZ0Tov7yECQ
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can?

card9ats

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #28 on: 20 February 2013 07:54:43 PM »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiaLIqHOsb8


card9ats

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Re: grappling with the myths 2
« Reply #29 on: 20 February 2013 08:24:32 PM »
Hello mr X

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JSBhI_0at0

« Last Edit: 20 February 2013 08:38:44 PM by card9ats »